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Does Cabrera take the triple crown with a few games left?  Rate Topic 
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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 05:27 pm
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dogfacedgremlin34
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stingmark wrote: I thought he was a gold glover for the Marlins (it was a silver slugger that he has 3 of)

Did you seriously just confuse a Gold Glove with a Silver Slugger?



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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 05:28 pm
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thunderbolt
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PeteF3 wrote: ::scratches head:: Who's calling Trout a HOFer?

Miguel Cabrera is an incredible hitter. Probably will end up in Cooperstown unless he completely collapses or pulls a Pete Rose. But THIS YEAR, Triple Crown or not, Mike Trout is a better overall PLAYER. That's all anyone is saying.

Thank goodness somebody gets it.  This was making my head hurt.

Cabrera may very well win MVP, but my only point is that, factoring every aspect of the game of baseball, Trout is for this season and at this moment, a better PLAYER.  Comparing the two is like comparing Boog Powell to Mickey Mantle.



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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 05:29 pm
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stingmark



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dogfacedgremlin34 wrote: stingmark wrote: I thought he was a gold glover for the Marlins (it was a silver slugger that he has 3 of)

Did you seriously just confuse a Gold Glove with a Silver Slugger?

Yes, I did...pardon me for not knowing every award Cabrera has won. I assumed he'd won a gg with the marlins...



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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 05:33 pm
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stingmark



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thunderbolt wrote: PeteF3 wrote: ::scratches head:: Who's calling Trout a HOFer?

Miguel Cabrera is an incredible hitter. Probably will end up in Cooperstown unless he completely collapses or pulls a Pete Rose. But THIS YEAR, Triple Crown or not, Mike Trout is a better overall PLAYER. That's all anyone is saying.

Thank goodness somebody gets it.  This was making my head hurt.

Cabrera may very well win MVP, but my only point is that, factoring every aspect of the game of baseball, Trout is for this season and at this moment, a better PLAYER.  Comparing the two is like comparing Boog Powell to Mickey Mantle.


No one said anything about Trout not being a better overall player THIS year than Cabrera. Overall, he's definltey better in a few categories. The question though, was about the TC, and as it pertains to that(and ONLY that), Cabrera has had the better year offensively(which is what the TC is based on). Thats all I've been saying.  Cabrera will win the TC & most likely the MVP too.

Title of the thread isnt "who's the better player overall between the two in 2012", it's about the TC, and who do we think will win it, between Cabrera and Trout, I said Cabrera, and people freaked out. Freak out when they give the TC to Carbera, maybe some here can start an "Occupy TC" Movement or a 'sit in" to protest it not going to Trout?

Last edited on Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 05:34 pm by stingmark



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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 06:13 pm
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lobo316
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mike3775 wrote: Trout became the first rookie to be a member of the 30/30 club

If he had been in the majors from opening day, he probably be a member of the 40/40 club

He'll win ROY award, so the voters will give the MVP award to Miggy.

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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 07:04 pm
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I don't think this has been mentiioned yet but let's not forget that Ted Williams won the Triple Crown twice ( 1942 and 1947 ) and didn't win the AL MVP either year.

1942

Joe Gordon - NY Yankees ( 270 MVP voting points )
Ted Williams - Boston Red Sox ( 249 MVP voting points )

Williams scored 53 more runs, had 13 more hits, had 18 more HRs, had 34 more RBI and outhit Gordon .356 to .322

I'm guessing the voters gave Gordon more votes as the Yankees won the AL Pennant by 9 games over Boston.



1947

Joe DiMaggio - NY Yankees ( 202 MVP voting points )
Ted Williams - Boston Red Sox ( 201 MVP voting points )

Williams scored 28 more runs, had 13 more hits, had 12 more HRs, had 17 more RBI and outhit DiMaggio .343 to .315

Once again the voters must have given winning the AL Pennant a lot of credence as Boston finished in 3rd place 14 games behind the Yankees.




One other thing to keep in mind - the last 3 Triple Crown winners ( Mickey Mantle in 1956, Frank Robinson in 1966 and Carl Yastrezemski in 1967 ) all won the AL MVP award the same year.



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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 07:24 pm
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mike3775



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lobo316 wrote: mike3775 wrote: Trout became the first rookie to be a member of the 30/30 club

If he had been in the majors from opening day, he probably be a member of the 40/40 club

He'll win ROY award, so the voters will give the MVP award to Miggy.
He should win that easily.  Not so sure on Harper in the NL though

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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 07:28 pm
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CanadianHorseman wrote: I don't think this has been mentiioned yet but let's not forget that Ted Williams won the Triple Crown twice ( 1942 and 1947 ) and didn't win the AL MVP either year.

1942

Joe Gordon - NY Yankees ( 270 MVP voting points )
Ted Williams - Boston Red Sox ( 249 MVP voting points )

Williams scored 53 more runs, had 13 more hits, had 18 more HRs, had 34 more RBI and outhit Gordon .356 to .322

I'm guessing the voters gave Gordon more votes as the Yankees won the AL Pennant by 9 games over Boston.



1947

Joe DiMaggio - NY Yankees ( 202 MVP voting points )
Ted Williams - Boston Red Sox ( 201 MVP voting points )

Williams scored 28 more runs, had 13 more hits, had 12 more HRs, had 17 more RBI and outhit DiMaggio .343 to .315

Once again the voters must have given winning the AL Pennant a lot of credence as Boston finished in 3rd place 14 games behind the Yankees.




One other thing to keep in mind - the last 3 Triple Crown winners ( Mickey Mantle in 1956, Frank Robinson in 1966 and Carl Yastrezemski in 1967 ) all won the AL MVP award the same year.
To be fair though, in the early 1940's, there wasn't much emphasis put on the triple crown.  It wasn't until the mid 1940's that writers and the media started to hype the triple crown.

Plus they always place a higher emphasis on teams making the playoffs over anything else.  Not many MVP's do not make the playoffs with that award

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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 07:43 pm
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lobo316
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mike3775 wrote: CanadianHorseman wrote: I don't think this has been mentiioned yet but let's not forget that Ted Williams won the Triple Crown twice ( 1942 and 1947 ) and didn't win the AL MVP either year.

1942

Joe Gordon - NY Yankees ( 270 MVP voting points )
Ted Williams - Boston Red Sox ( 249 MVP voting points )

Williams scored 53 more runs, had 13 more hits, had 18 more HRs, had 34 more RBI and outhit Gordon .356 to .322

I'm guessing the voters gave Gordon more votes as the Yankees won the AL Pennant by 9 games over Boston.



1947

Joe DiMaggio - NY Yankees ( 202 MVP voting points )
Ted Williams - Boston Red Sox ( 201 MVP voting points )

Williams scored 28 more runs, had 13 more hits, had 12 more HRs, had 17 more RBI and outhit DiMaggio .343 to .315

Once again the voters must have given winning the AL Pennant a lot of credence as Boston finished in 3rd place 14 games behind the Yankees.




One other thing to keep in mind - the last 3 Triple Crown winners ( Mickey Mantle in 1956, Frank Robinson in 1966 and Carl Yastrezemski in 1967 ) all won the AL MVP award the same year.
To be fair though, in the early 1940's, there wasn't much emphasis put on the triple crown.  It wasn't until the mid 1940's that writers and the media started to hype the triple crown.

Plus they always place a higher emphasis on teams making the playoffs over anything else.  Not many MVP's do not make the playoffs with that award

Actually, the writers hated Williams (and he them). Not voting for Williams was their way of screwing him.

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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 08:50 pm
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lobo316 wrote: mike3775 wrote: CanadianHorseman wrote: I don't think this has been mentiioned yet but let's not forget that Ted Williams won the Triple Crown twice ( 1942 and 1947 ) and didn't win the AL MVP either year.

1942

Joe Gordon - NY Yankees ( 270 MVP voting points )
Ted Williams - Boston Red Sox ( 249 MVP voting points )

Williams scored 53 more runs, had 13 more hits, had 18 more HRs, had 34 more RBI and outhit Gordon .356 to .322

I'm guessing the voters gave Gordon more votes as the Yankees won the AL Pennant by 9 games over Boston.



1947

Joe DiMaggio - NY Yankees ( 202 MVP voting points )
Ted Williams - Boston Red Sox ( 201 MVP voting points )

Williams scored 28 more runs, had 13 more hits, had 12 more HRs, had 17 more RBI and outhit DiMaggio .343 to .315

Once again the voters must have given winning the AL Pennant a lot of credence as Boston finished in 3rd place 14 games behind the Yankees.




One other thing to keep in mind - the last 3 Triple Crown winners ( Mickey Mantle in 1956, Frank Robinson in 1966 and Carl Yastrezemski in 1967 ) all won the AL MVP award the same year.
To be fair though, in the early 1940's, there wasn't much emphasis put on the triple crown.  It wasn't until the mid 1940's that writers and the media started to hype the triple crown.

Plus they always place a higher emphasis on teams making the playoffs over anything else.  Not many MVP's do not make the playoffs with that award

Actually, the writers hated Williams (and he them). Not voting for Williams was their way of screwing him.

One of those years, a writer left him out of the top 10.  Even a 10th place vote by that one writer would've gotten him the MVP.  He just wouldn't vote for him because of his pettiness. 



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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 09:12 pm
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That's similar to what happened to Ray Bourque during the 1989-90 season. Bourque and Mark Messier were the top 2 candidates for the Hart Memorial Trophy ( NHL MVP ) and Messier ended up winning by just a few points. Later it was revealed that an Edmonton sports writer did not put Bourque in his top 10 list when even a 9th place vote would have resulted in a tie and a 8th place vote would have given the award to Bourque. :X



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 Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2012 09:34 pm
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lobo316 wrote: mike3775 wrote: Trout became the first rookie to be a member of the 30/30 club

If he had been in the majors from opening day, he probably be a member of the 40/40 club

He'll win ROY award, so the voters will give the MVP award to Miggy.

He should win the ROY award, no question. He had a great year, he just had it when someone else had a better one.



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 Posted: Thu Oct 4th, 2012 01:54 am
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CanadianHorseman wrote: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That's similar to what happened to Ray Bourque during the 1989-90 season. Bourque and Mark Messier were the top 2 candidates for the Hart Memorial Trophy ( NHL MVP ) and Messier ended up winning by just a few points. Later it was revealed that an Edmonton sports writer did not put Bourque in his top 10 list when even a 9th place vote would have resulted in a tie and a 8th place vote would have given the award to Bourque. :X

I never knew this, Moose all the way though!  At least Bourque managed to help Boston win 1 game of the finals in '90.  Plus the power stayed on all series at the Gardens!



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 Posted: Thu Oct 4th, 2012 02:09 am
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CanadianHorseman



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Cory17 wrote:
CanadianHorseman wrote: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That's similar to what happened to Ray Bourque during the 1989-90 season. Bourque and Mark Messier were the top 2 candidates for the Hart Memorial Trophy ( NHL MVP ) and Messier ended up winning by just a few points. Later it was revealed that an Edmonton sports writer did not put Bourque in his top 10 list when even a 9th place vote would have resulted in a tie and a 8th place vote would have given the award to Bourque. :X

I never knew this, Moose all the way though!  At least Bourque managed to help Boston win 1 game of the finals in '90.  Plus the power stayed on all series at the Gardens!


Ah SHADDUP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!



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 Posted: Thu Oct 4th, 2012 04:15 am
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stingmark wrote: Principal_Raditch wrote: You're only look at Offence though. Trout's a gold glover, Cabrera might be the worst 3b in MLB. So Offensively Cabrera has a slight advantage. On the basepaths, Trout has a massive advantage. Defensively Trout has a massive advantage. It's a close call.

They dont give a player the TC because of defense, as it's an offensive based award, so your argument about his defense, is moot as it pertains to the TC. I believe Cabrera is  a gold glover in the past. He switched positions so that Fielder could play first base, I would guess that if you were the manager, you'd probably do something similar.

Then how did Jimmy Rollins win the MVP with shittier offensive numbers than at least 4 other players in 2007? I was talking about winning an MVP based on overall ability, not TC.

Last edited on Thu Oct 4th, 2012 04:19 am by Principal_Raditch

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