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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 08:51 pm
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silentkiller



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Anyone here believe in the story of Noah's Ark?



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 08:56 pm
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srossi

 

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Of course, how else do you explain the extinction of the dinosaurs?  Sheesh, some people just have no common sense.

Last edited on Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 08:57 pm by srossi



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:05 pm
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BigJ



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silentkiller wrote: Anyone here believe in the story of Noah's Ark?
*sigh* This goes into a whole trip where people will insist that the Bible's completely absurd, Christians are stupid, etc that I generally stay away from.

Literally?  Did God tell an old man to get one of each gender of every animal on the planet and put 'em in a boat and get ready for the flood? 

I don't fucking know, I guess so.  I believe in God, thus I believe in God's word which is to arguable degrees presented in the Bible so I guess yeah that's true.

Truth of the matter is I think there was a lot of metaphorical shit going on in the writing of the Bible, and a lot of fable-styled moral-based stories that had been handed down and were documented that yeah, while totally unbelievable, are probably based on something along the line that actually happened but have been so bastardized by the various edits and versions throughout time that its like a game of telephone.

So, to sum up - do I believe Noah's Ark could have happened, in literal terms, as described?  No.  Do I believe something happened?  Yeah. 


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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:06 pm
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beejmi
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Didn't they find it (or think they found it?) on some mountain in Turkey years ago?

I am thinking they found something that matches that Biblical dimensions of the boat. I didn't pay much attention to that story and I have no clue if "Turkey" matches where the Biblical teaching says it should be.

 

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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:10 pm
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srossi

 

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beejmi wrote: Didn't they find it (or think they found it?) on some mountain in Turkey years ago?

I am thinking they found something that matches that Biblical dimensions of the boat. I didn't pay much attention to that story and I have no clue if "Turkey" matches where the Biblical teaching says it should be.

 

Turkey does indeed match where it would've been.  Scam-artists aren't THAT dumb.  This is from Wiki because I'm lazy, but it's accurate.

In 2007, a joint Turkish-Hong Kong expedition team found what is thought to be fossilized wood in a cave on Mount Ararat in Turkey. A sample of the "wood" was analyzed by the Department of Earth Sciences of the University of Hong Kong but the results were inconclusive. The origin of the material remains unknown, but the group suggests that it is part of Noah's Ark.[79] Photographs of "thin sections" of the "wood" have been examined by several creationist geologists who concur that this is likely volcanic tuff. It has been suggested that the finding is a ploy to increase tourism in the area.[80]



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:16 pm
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srossi

 

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As almost everyone SHOULD know by now (but doesn't), the story of Noah's Arc is pure plagarism, just like virtually every story in the Bible including the birth of Christ itself.  These stories are derivative of other fables and stories that were around for centuries prior.  Noah's Arc is a story that originated in Babylonian and Sumarian religions with the names changed.  Christianity is an extremely young religion and there's not one new idea in it.  All the stories were already told but history is written by the winners, and Jesus won. 

Edit: I looked it up, so to be more specific Noah's Arc was originally the Epic of Gilgamesh.  It's an ancient Sumarian poem.  Some details were taken from that, and a few sprinkles of other stories were thrown in to flesh out the tale. 

Last edited on Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:20 pm by srossi



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:19 pm
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BigJ



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srossi wrote: As almost everyone SHOULD know by now (but doesn't), the story of Noah's Arc is pure plagarism, just like virtually every story in the Bible including the birth of Christ itself.  These stories are derivative of other fables and stories that were around for centuries prior.  Noah's Arc is a story that originated in Babylonian and Sumarian religions with the names changed.  Christianity is an extremely young religion and there's not one new idea in it.  All the stories were already told but history is written by the winners, and Jesus won. 

Source?  (no, seriously...)

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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:20 pm
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srossi

 

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BigJ wrote: srossi wrote: As almost everyone SHOULD know by now (but doesn't), the story of Noah's Arc is pure plagarism, just like virtually every story in the Bible including the birth of Christ itself.  These stories are derivative of other fables and stories that were around for centuries prior.  Noah's Arc is a story that originated in Babylonian and Sumarian religions with the names changed.  Christianity is an extremely young religion and there's not one new idea in it.  All the stories were already told but history is written by the winners, and Jesus won. 

Source?  (no, seriously...)

Beat you to it.  Look above.  If you want me to find you the story of Jesus' birth told 150 different ways prior to the writing of the New Testament I can do that too but my memory sucks so I'll have to look shit up again and I really don't feel like doing it right now.  But it's all there, the virgin birth, wisemen bringing gifts, born in a manger, etc.  All conclusively proven to pre-date Christianity.

Last edited on Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:23 pm by srossi



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:24 pm
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thunderbolt
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Doesn't just about every single culture with a written history have a story of an ancient great flood presented as historical fact occurring at roughly the same time?



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:27 pm
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srossi

 

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thunderbolt wrote: Doesn't just about every single culture with a written history have a story of an ancient great flood presented as historical fact occurring at roughly the same time?

Abso-freaking-lutely.  I believe this is the earliest though.  Could be others that were earlier.  It's like trying to find the true beginning of anything.  Who invented rock 'n' roll?  Who invented the radio for that matter?  Look these things up and you'll see a million people taking each other's ideas and changing them slightly until you can't find a clear origin.  One thing is completely clear, 2000 years is nothing in the grand scheme of things and all these stories pre-date it.

Last edited on Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:28 pm by srossi



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:29 pm
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BigJ



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srossi wrote: BigJ wrote: srossi wrote: As almost everyone SHOULD know by now (but doesn't), the story of Noah's Arc is pure plagarism, just like virtually every story in the Bible including the birth of Christ itself.  These stories are derivative of other fables and stories that were around for centuries prior.  Noah's Arc is a story that originated in Babylonian and Sumarian religions with the names changed.  Christianity is an extremely young religion and there's not one new idea in it.  All the stories were already told but history is written by the winners, and Jesus won. 

Source?  (no, seriously...)

Beat you to it.  Look above.  If you want me to find you the story of Jesus' birth told 150 different ways prior to the writing of the New Testament I can do that too but my memory sucks so I'll have to look shit up again and I really don't feel like doing it right now.  But it's all there, the virgin birth, wisemen bringing gifts, born in a manger, etc.  All conclusively proven to pre-date Christianity.

Thank ye.  Not doubting ya just wasn't aware.

All this really means is that yeah it happened.  LOL

Last edited on Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:30 pm by BigJ

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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:33 pm
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srossi

 

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I'm really interested in this stuff and have researched it for years.  I posted an "Origin of Holidays" thread at OSW years ago before the board redesign and I wish I could find it again but I can't.  It had everything in there, including why we celebrate Christmas in December even though we know that the historical Jesus was born in either March or May.  It's all just to compete with Pagan holidays that pre-dated Christianity.  The problem is that my memory sucks so every time these issues come up I have to look it up again, but at least I remember enough to usually be able to find it quickly now.

This is why I get pissed when people say, "Well even if you don't believe, the Bible is still a great work of art."  It's not.  It's actually a bastardization of art because it takes many classic stories and changes them, with the result not being nearly as good and also with the result usually changing from the original author's intent.  The Bible is a poorly re-written anthology of great works of literature and mythological/theological works.  All edited by a megalomaniac who chose what to include and not include years after the fact.

Last edited on Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:42 pm by srossi



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:36 pm
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silentkiller



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srossi wrote: I'm really interested in this stuff and have researched it for years.  I posted an "Origin of Holidays" thread at OSW years ago before the board redesign and I wish I could find it again but I can't.  It had everything in there, including why we celebrate Christmas in December even though we know that the historical Jesus was born in either March or May.  It's all just to compete with Pagan holidays that pre-dated Christianity.  The problem is that my memory sucks so every time these issues come up I have to look it up again, but at least I remember enough to usually be able to find it quickly now.

Knowing that do you celebrate Christmas?



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:36 pm
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thunderbolt
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Well, the book of the old testament which contain the flood story was actually written about 1400 b.c. as a historical document based on very old anecdotal accounts.

The only point I am making is that the commonality as to timing and relative geographic proximity of the cultures recording the event seem to me to make it more likely that some great flood did occur.



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 Posted: Fri Oct 3rd, 2008 09:42 pm
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BigJ



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srossi wrote: I'm really interested in this stuff and have researched it for years. 
Ever research the missing books of the Bible?  That's some fun stuff right there.

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