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WWE taking steps against groups running Wrestlemania 31 weekend  Rate Topic 
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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 06:42 pm
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Superstar
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Count Grog wrote: Superstar wrote: Count Grog wrote: petty and not surprising if its not WWEE they want it to die

Nothing about business is petty, my friend...just ask every company that tries to use the term "Super Bowl" this week.  99% of them will call it the "Big Game"...for fear of being sued.

WWE pretty much leaves everybody else alone, including all those people that sell bootleg product at shows and events.  That is, until Wrestlemania weekend.  Then they go out of their way to push their muscle around.  Because Wrestlemania is their "Big Game", and they want to be the only show in town.  I can't blame them one bit.

If you mean Walmarting the wrestling world is a ok business model that's where you and I differ.  But why should WWE take the risk of fans seeing better action on an indy show than what they charge wayyyyy to much money for.  If the indies are calling their show WrestleMania  in some form then I see the issue, shutting down competition even if it doesn't hurt you at all is petty.

We do differ a little - you are comparing them to WalMart, I'm comparing them to the NFL.  Vince has followed the NFL business model for as long as I can remember, because he wants to be as big in the mainstream as they are.   For the record, I don't like the WWE business model because in my opinion it drives away the people that pay for their product...wrestling fans.  Honestly, outside of little kids, do you really think there are adults that like the way the product has evolved.  I haven't heard one person over the age of 10 say that wrestling is better now than it was five years ago.  My kids started watching when they were 9 and 7.  They are now almost 15 and 13 and neither watch.  Reason is that it bores them now.  They liked the wrestling, not the fake drama.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 07:16 pm
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Count Grog
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Superstar I agree with you on what he did to wrestling and see your point on the business model of the NFL, but is the NFL stopping bars or sport card shops from having old NFL players come in and sign autographs. Its hard to compare indy football groups from playing as that's not going to happen especially this week in the snow. But I bet there are hundreds of non sanctioned events happening in the metro New York area that are drawing in fans and the NFL is not stopping them unless they say its a Super Bowl of wing eating or something. But Vince did Walmart the wrestling business, he came in a monopolized it and put all competitors out of business. There was a time in this country that was illegal but with the ending of the Sherman Anti trust act that is what America has become one big Walmart-Home Depot-Applebee's-McDonalds-WWE kind of world with limited choices and a homogenized product. no ROH and Dragon Gate can't compete on a scale with WWE but there is a segment that would like to see that just like if I was there I would attend Kuju Big Battel



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 07:24 pm
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srossi

 

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Count Grog wrote: There was a time in this country that was illegal but with the ending of the Sherman Anti trust act that is what America has become one big Walmart-Home Depot-Applebee's-McDonalds-WWE kind of world with limited choices and a homogenized product.
Um, the Sherman Antitrust Act didn't "end", and none of those companies are monopolies.  The NFL is actually a monopoly, but not those others. 



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 07:29 pm
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Count Grog
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The Sherman anti Trust act is not enforced because Wal mart while not a monopoly could not come into small town USA and put out of business all the mom and pop stores the way they do. No none of those at=re monopolies but all use the same tactics that kill small business.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 07:39 pm
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srossi

 

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Count Grog wrote: The Sherman anti Trust act is not enforced because Wal mart while not a monopoly could not come into small town USA and put out of business all the mom and pop stores the way they do. No none of those at=re monopolies but all use the same tactics that kill small business.
I think you're confused about what the Sherman Antitrust Act is supposed to do then. 



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 07:46 pm
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Count Grog
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ok Mr. know it all I used the fucking wrong law. My fucking point is that Walmart and Applebees and Home Depot come in to small towns put the local stores and restaurants out of business and then the folks are left with limited choices much the same way Vince put the territories out of business and left wrestling fans with a bland uniteresting product.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 07:56 pm
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yellowdog



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Vince has fucked up every other aspect of wrestling so it's no surprise he's trying to continue his Genghis Khan like destruction of all things wrestling. I thought competition was valued in our country.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 08:14 pm
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srossi

 

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yellowdog wrote: Vince has fucked up every other aspect of wrestling so it's no surprise he's trying to continue his Genghis Khan like destruction of all things wrestling. I thought competition was valued in our country.
If Vince was smart he'd value the top indies since most of his biggest recent stars came from there (Punk, Bryan, Ambrose, Rollins, etc.).  God knows their developmental system isn't churning out future stars, and if Vince is delusional enough to think that NXT is why these guys succeeded then that's his problem.  So WWE is clearly benefitting from indy companies that can put on big shows and give the stars of tomorrow some exposure.  Competition benefits everyone.  But Vince has a right to do what he's doing, even if it is short-sighted and petty.  Vince has certainly been this way for decades, although the old cry "Vince killed the territories" is silly and inaccurate, just one of those things that people here so much they lose all common sense and critical thinking ability.  Vince would love to take credit for that, but the owners of the territories killed the territories.

Last edited on Wed Jan 29th, 2014 08:17 pm by srossi



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 08:25 pm
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yellowdog



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I agree with much of what you wrote but "vince did kill the territories" by signing all the territory tops stars for way more money than the territories could afford. It's difficult for many mid carders to ascend to Main Event status. They lost their top stars and unlike the past couldn't get talent from other territories because they also signed with Vince. Imagine what the NFL would become if you took the top 5-8 stars from each team.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 08:30 pm
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srossi

 

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yellowdog wrote: I agree with much of what you wrote but "vince did kill the territories" by signing all the territory tops stars for way more money than the territories could afford. It's difficult for many mid carders to ascend to Main Event status. They lost their top stars and unlike the past couldn't get talent from other territories because they also signed with Vince. Imagine what the NFL would become if you took the top 5-8 stars from each team.
The territories were already dying because the world was moving and they weren't.  What happened was inevitable.  The failure to understand cable TV and globalization killed the territories.  Any of those guys would've done the same thing if they knew where to begin, or even understood that times were changing.  Promoters accused Dumont of killing wrestling too when they started airing matches on TV in the '50s instead of making fans go to live shows.  Every sports owner hated that idea.  I think TV worked out OK for sports. 



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 08:47 pm
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yellowdog



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The territories were seeing some decline but that was typical for the wrestling industry which was very cyclical before Kayfabe was broken. I agree if it wasn't Vince someone else may have done a similar thing and it was eventually inevitable. But it was Vince. He accelerated the transition dramatically. Remember we're talking early 80s not late 80s. I agree with you on your Dumont analogy except I don't think it's comparable to Vince poaching the top talent from all the territories. It also took the promoters a short time to realize how to use TV to get people to buy tickets. They embraced it quickly. Let's not forget that Vince also bought out many of the territories TV contracts and the territoires lost their primary source of promotion for the live events. Attendance and revenue goes down. No top stars to rebound financially. It was just too much for smaller companies to absorb. Not unlike Walmart, buying massive quantities at a time, lowering prices below what independent stores could afford.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 29th, 2014 08:55 pm
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nyhack56 wrote: At the convention last year in Seacaucus during WM weekend they sent the gestapo in to confiscate bootlegs. I believe it was on Sunday during WM."Gestapo". I mean, bootlegs are illegal, right? It's not like they're inventing a new law just to piss you off.

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 Posted: Thu Jan 30th, 2014 10:21 am
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Geheime Staats-Polizei - Secret State Police. 1 out of 3 in this case.

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 Posted: Thu Jan 30th, 2014 06:54 pm
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This makes perfect sense to me. 
If a fan comes into town with $500 in his pocket, the WWE wants Wrestlemania to be the place where he spends the whole wad. They don't want him spending a portion of it at competing shows. It's good business.

Last edited on Thu Jan 30th, 2014 07:05 pm by TXM

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 Posted: Thu Jan 30th, 2014 07:16 pm
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Count Grog
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TXM wrote: This makes perfect sense to me. 
If a fan comes into town with $500 in his pocket, the WWE wants Wrestlemania to be the place where he spends the whole wad. They don't want him spending a portion of it at competing shows. It's good business.


If your average wrestling comes to town for WrestleMania with $500 in his pocket he will probably spend it at the comic book store, strip club, hookers, all you can eat buffets



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