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 Posted: Tue Apr 4th, 2017 02:24 pm
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Mysterious



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LAF wrote: Mysterious wrote: LAF wrote: Raditch mentioned the St. Louis Hawks moving to Atlanta in the NBA. Well they started off as the Tri-City Blackhawks in Illinois. They moved to Milwaukee and then to St. Louis.

The CFL had the Sacramento Gold Miners become the San Antonio Texans and the Baltimore Stallions become the new Montreal Alouettes but not before winning a Grey Cup for the US.

The Edmonton Rush became the Saskatchewan Rush in indoor lacrosse. ;)

CFL and NLL don't count. We're talking about leagues that make money.

The CFL is doing very well and has a sweetheart TV deal

Most teams barely make a profit and it's largest market loses money every year. It couldn't even sell out the Grey Cup.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 4th, 2017 04:03 pm
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LAF



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Don't charge high prices then in a hockey/soccer/frontrunning market. $169-$899? Yeesh 

Last edited on Tue Apr 4th, 2017 04:05 pm by LAF

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 Posted: Tue Apr 4th, 2017 04:19 pm
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LAF



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tamalie wrote: The amount of money the Buffalo Braves received from the New York Knicks for Bob McAdoo was not insignificant at $3,000,000, which is nearly $13,000,000 in present day dollars. For a team as cash starved as the Braves, that was real money. The Seattle Supersonics offered $2,000,000 plus two players, but got shut down in the bidding war because McAdoo's then wife wouldn't move west and Bob didn't want to be that far from his family.
I do agree with ths. The Braves were also plagued by poor lease terms at Memorial Auditorium. They actually only had third dibs on dates at the building. The Sabres were first, but second spot went to Canisius College basketball. They would select Saturday nights and did so thinking it would help save college basketball in the community. Low budget Jesuit schools were going to have a hard time keeping up in the NCAA......fast forward 40 years and all the local schools are mid majors that maybe draw 2,000 on a good night. They only book 1 day per year in the arena now.

I read an article in the newspaper 2 or 3 years ago that TV ratings for Braves games were actually higher than for the Sabres. I found that odd and interesting.

Last edited on Tue Apr 4th, 2017 04:21 pm by LAF

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 Posted: Tue Apr 4th, 2017 05:17 pm
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Mysterious



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LAF wrote: Don't charge high prices then in a hockey/soccer/frontrunning market. $169-$899? Yeesh 
Actually the Raptors are bigger than TFC at the moment and so are the Blue Jays. The Argos and the CFL are the 5th team in Toronto now. CFL only draws in Canadian cities that have nothing else other than the NHL. The biggest CFL team in terms of fan base are the Saskatchewan Roughriders which is the only CFL city that does not have an NHL team. You could argue Hamilton Tiger Cats but people in Hamilton make up a fair bit of the Buffalo Sabers fan base.

Last edited on Tue Apr 4th, 2017 05:18 pm by Mysterious

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 Posted: Sat Apr 8th, 2017 04:48 am
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Mysterious wrote: LAF wrote: Mysterious wrote: LAF wrote: Raditch mentioned the St. Louis Hawks moving to Atlanta in the NBA. Well they started off as the Tri-City Blackhawks in Illinois. They moved to Milwaukee and then to St. Louis.

The CFL had the Sacramento Gold Miners become the San Antonio Texans and the Baltimore Stallions become the new Montreal Alouettes but not before winning a Grey Cup for the US.

The Edmonton Rush became the Saskatchewan Rush in indoor lacrosse. ;)

CFL and NLL don't count. We're talking about leagues that make money.

The CFL is doing very well and has a sweetheart TV deal

Most teams barely make a profit and it's largest market loses money every year. It couldn't even sell out the Grey Cup.

The people of Toronto are an outlier. The Winnipeg Blue Bombers had an "off" year in terms of events at their stadium this season, and still turned a $2.8 million profit.



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 Posted: Mon Apr 10th, 2017 08:28 pm
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tamalie
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kargol wrote: In rugby, Wasps moved from London to Coventry a couple of years back when they ran out of money and had to sell their ground. That's about 100 miles.

When Wasps packed up and left London for Coventry, I expected to hear a lot more outcry, but after a few weeks and a few protesting voices, the subject died out. Is there a particular reason this wasn't bigger deal, even within the context of rugby union?

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 Posted: Wed Apr 12th, 2017 10:37 pm
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kargol



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Nobody really cares about rugby union. Only private schools and the posh. Plus there had been similar less brutal moves before; Harlequins for instance playing at Watford. Many rugby clubs are in fact what football clubs were in the 1860s - gentlemen's clubs where membership was via some sort of social link (e.g. former schools, employment) rather than geographical location.

Plus the top division of rugby union is effectively a closed shop because of the vast differences in professionalism and income between it and the next one down. London Welsh tried to compete when they got promoted and it drove them into insolvency. So there was no chance a Midlands representative could get up there without some serious help.



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 Posted: Thu Apr 13th, 2017 05:18 am
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beejmi
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Kargol -- do soccer teams move around a bit or do they kind of stay in one spot 99% of the time?

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 Posted: Thu Apr 13th, 2017 07:12 am
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kargol



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Stay in one spot. It's against League regulations to move. As I said, the only one that's happened since the war was under very special circumstances, was universally condemned, made the League look an utter joke, and has been counter-productive as the "original" team fought its way back from oblivion to higher than the "stolen" team.



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 Posted: Mon Apr 17th, 2017 03:51 am
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The Ultimate Sin
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LAF wrote: Funny that McAdoo was given away and then Brown massively overpaid to get him back.

But such was the NBA of the late 70s and early 80s with overmatched owners making horrible decisions and getting ripped off. Ted Stepien comes to mind.

Was McAdoo a dick or something?  For a player with that much talent he sure bounced around a lot.



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 Posted: Mon Apr 17th, 2017 04:37 am
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Mysterious



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The Ultimate Sin wrote: LAF wrote: Funny that McAdoo was given away and then Brown massively overpaid to get him back.

But such was the NBA of the late 70s and early 80s with overmatched owners making horrible decisions and getting ripped off. Ted Stepien comes to mind.

Was McAdoo a dick or something?  For a player with that much talent he sure bounced around a lot.
You just described many NBA stars over the past two decades. Cousins being the most recent.

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 Posted: Mon Apr 17th, 2017 03:18 pm
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tamalie
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Bob McAdoo was considered a problem on three fronts in his prime, despite his gaudy numbers. One, he was overly concerned with his own scoring and rebounding (mostly offensive boards) stats to the extent of not caring about the potential benefits of playing team basketball instead. Two, he was not only a lousy defensive player, he barely cared to play defense at all. Three, he was a moody and sullen presence in the locker room, not at all a leader which is so often demanded and expected of the best players. Eventually, after a bad end to his time with the Pistons and a brief, but disastrous, run with the Nets, he got things turned around. He wound up with the Lakers in the early to mid 1980s as Kareem's backup and won a couple of championship rings. He also mended his attitude, which was partly stemming from severe shyness. His second wife, whom he met during his post NBA career in Italy, is regarded almost universally for bringing him further out of his shell, making him a better person, and setting the stage for his lengthy career as an NBA assistant coach.

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 Posted: Mon Apr 17th, 2017 04:59 pm
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LAF



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McAdoo is fondly remembered in Buffalo by those old enough, along with Ernie DiGregorio and Randy Smith. He was never really considered a good defensive player, but was dynamite for his era as a big man on offense. I think more of his problem came to the fore at his later stops before he became the venerable, respected 6th man on the Lakers 

I'm also not old enough, so my Braves knowledge is mostly from stories, reading, highlights, and the half-dozen or so Braves games available on video. There's a 1975 playoff game against the Bullets out there where McAdoo scores 50 and is just unstoppable.

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