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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 11:06 am
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beejmi
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Through the magic of video, we can go back and watch the old time territory wrestling.
Give your thoughts - I will give you a few of mine (random)

Detroit - doubt I have ever seen a complete show but the scraps that remain do nothing for me.

Mid Atlantic - WOW. Boy howdy. Especially late 70s early 80s w Flair, Piper, Brisco, Steamboat. Tremendous.

Florida- I like it. It has a bit of an edge to it. Dusty's the star.

Georgia - Its ok but I still like Mid Atlantic and Florida better.



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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 12:15 pm
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Principal_Raditch



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Vancouver Tomko...Atrocious, but so bad it's good for comic value. Not much survived, but low rent studio, low rent workers..yet seemed to be on about 3 different channels in Toronto when I was growing up.

Memphis. Commentary is hilarious. Matches are generally the shits.

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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 01:58 pm
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The Ghost Of Amerorig Past



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I'm currently watching 4 old timey territories on the network and 1 piece of programming on YouTube.  My fandom started around 1982-ish, so I thought I'd go back and watch/re-watch some of the shows. Here's my thoughts so far:

WWWF All Star Wrestling, 1976-79:  Pretty bad.  Everybody talks about how great a commentator Vince was, but he was absolutely atrocious.  Pairing him with Rocca in the early part of this made him even worse.  You couldn't understand half of what he was saying, and the half you could understand was irrelevant.  And this doesn't even take into account the matches at the time.  Just terrible.  I can't recall if these got better by 1982-83, but the late seventies shows were really bad.  The managers just openly beat up on the jobbers outside the ring in full view of the refs with no consequence.  Every show seemed to feature Butcher Vachon and Baron Sicluna, which isn't a good thing.  There were seemingly no real good angles.  Just a tough time frame to be watching, I had to take a break.  

World Class Championship Wrestling, 1981-82:  I'm pretty fired up to relive WCCW from Dec. 1982 through the end of 1984, which for me was probably the hottest two years of territorial wrestling in the time that I was watching.  I'm only up to January 1982 so far, and let me tell you, this period is pretty brutal.  The pre Bill Mercer commentator is some guy who knows absolutely nothing about wrestling (sounds like he might've been a radio guy or something) and the matches are really nothing special.  Way too much past their prime guys in in-ring action, like Jose Lothario and Armand Hussein, and the Von Erich boys haven't really found their niche yet (plus, I believe this might've been the time that David was in Florida, so you have Kevin and Kerry--both brutal at this stage in their career on the stick--trying to carry the show). I've still got to wade through several episodes of this stuff before it really starts to get good.

Mid-South Wrestling, 1981-82:  Of the territories I'm watching now, this is the one of which I'd seen the least amount of footage.  From what I've seen so far, it's probably the best. Boyd Pierce isn't bad on commentary, and he's usually joined by capable guest commentators like Watts or Dibiase.  They're running a hand full of pretty decent angles and feuds now, like Orndorff/Dibiase and Sheik/Ellering, but not all come to a conclusion or have a payoff.  Also, some guys like Murdoch and Rhodes just randomly pop up apparently involved in angles with no backstory.  All in all though, a pretty good show for the time period. 

Mid Atlantic, 1981-82:  Like Mid-South this show is pretty good as well.  In terms of commentary, Caudle's--who never really did anything for me--is okay, and Crockett is, well, Crockett.  The biggest surprise from a commentary perspective is Piper.  I'd never heard much of his commentary from the old Mid Atlantic or GCW promotions, but hearing it now in bulk, I'm recognizing how grating he was--and not in a good way. It probably was awesome in 1982, but in 2018, a little goes a real long way. They are pretty angle driven, but they don't always follow through;  good case in point is this Cadillac Challenge tournament they were setting up, which was meant to be a one night tourney with a bunch of wrestlers in which the winner would get a brand new Caddy.  They plugged it hard for about three or four weeks and then...nothing.  Also, this Sgt. Slaughter Cobra Clutch Challenge with Blackjack Mulligan Jr. could've been so much better than it is, but now it's just getting a bit silly.  All in all though, they are making a tremendous effort.  

Georgia Championship Wrestling, 1982:  Just started watching this on the YouTubes.  Solie, of course, is terrific--which is weird, because I remember how much I couldn't stand him when I was a kid.  He really was very, very good, especially when comparing him to the likes of McMahon and that World Class goon.  In terms of wrestling, this is pretty much a carbon copy of Mid Atlantic--which I guess makes sense considering how closely the two promotions worked together.  The big standout for me here is a young Mad Dog Sawyer; I'd forgotten/never realized just how good he was when he was young and before he went crazy.  






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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 02:41 pm
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Qaenos

 

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For me, WWF 1984-1986 was as good as it will ever get. Hogan was a great champ during this time period. The underneath roster was a whos-who of the territories. The production values of the television became big-time, but the in-ring action was still oldschool. The gimmicks and pandering to children didn't start becoming ridiculous until later.

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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 02:42 pm
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Papa Voo



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The pandering to kids had already started in that timeframe.  I would say ‘85 was maybe your last good year before it went shithouse crazy with the Hulkamaniacs, the Goonies and all the other crap. 

Last edited on Mon Jun 4th, 2018 02:45 pm by Papa Voo



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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 02:51 pm
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Franchise
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Mid-South; I’ve probably watched 50-60 hrs of this promotion over the years and I tend to like what I see but it never hooks me to really invest my time. I don’t like the announcing and For whatever reason even the matches with name talent come across flat to me. At this point I think I’ll wait until the E gets everything on the network including house show footage and then try and give it a solid run.


WCCW; I watched about 10 episodes from 81/82 and found it to be ok if not forgettable. Other than bundy dressing like a hillbilly I can’t remember anything.


WWWF / WWF; I have a real hard time watching anything pre 1983 it’s just not my style.


MACW; from about 1984 on it’s gold to me before that it’s a little more hit and miss. Although I will say that with the Georgia and Mid South acquisitions MACW had too many belts.


AJPW; has its fair share of bad talent (kabuki, Kahn, baba, tiger and others I’m forgetting) but for the majority of the time their roster was stacked.

Last edited on Mon Jun 4th, 2018 02:53 pm by Franchise



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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 03:12 pm
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bpickering
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Stampede...Worst promotion I seen.



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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 05:47 pm
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MadFrogVachon

 

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When I first moved to St Louis from Nebraska in 1985 - I turned on Central States Wrestling to see what is was all about. The first episode I watched featured wrestlers I'd never heard of at that point - Bulldog Bob Brown, Marty Jannetty, Mr Pogo, Sheik Abdullah Ali Hassan the Great (the only sheik I'd ever seen with a New Jersey accent) because none of these guys ever got press in the Apter mags. Towards the end of the show they had Harley Race come out for a double chain match and I marked out big time.

I liked Central States wrestling for the most part but the commentators were horrible. The shows also ran the same three Magnum TA matches that he won in like 15 seconds a piece every week for months with promises that Magnum was "returning to the Central States Area."

They did a lot of importing of stars from other areas - Ted DiBiase came in to wrestle to a DDQ with Bob Brown, Ric Flair paid off Brown to cheat for him when Brown was referee for a Flair-Race Title match. Cousin Junior came in after leaving the WWF (billed as the star of the USA Network) and Flair sold for him big time, they showed a couple of Brody matches from time to time and one Flair-Mongolian Stomper match was aired fairly frequently.

Last edited on Mon Jun 4th, 2018 05:48 pm by MadFrogVachon

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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 05:52 pm
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srossi

 

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bpickering wrote: Stampede...Worst promotion I seen.
Stampede had some great matches.  The Owen Hart-Makhan Singh feud is one of the most underrated series of matches ever.  Early Bret, Dynamite, Davey Boy, Liger, just really good stuff that was the first time the style was seen in North America.  I hate to say it, but Ed Whalen, as beloved as he was, kills it for me.  I have to watch old tapes on mute because it's like listening to Mr. Rogers call wrestling.



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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 05:58 pm
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beejmi
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Forgot Mid South-UWF. Not sure I know the difference.

Roster seemed like the same guys over and over. Matches were good.


The Jim Ross 'We're Out Of Time !!!!!!!!!!!!'  with the 'main event' in progress at the end got really old

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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 07:09 pm
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DJP

 

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MadFrogVachon wrote: When I first moved to St Louis from Nebraska in 1985 - I turned on Central States Wrestling to see what is was all about. The first episode I watched featured wrestlers I'd never heard of at that point - Bulldog Bob Brown, Marty Jannetty, Mr Pogo, Sheik Abdullah Ali Hassan the Great (the only sheik I'd ever seen with a New Jersey accent) because none of these guys ever got press in the Apter mags. Towards the end of the show they had Harley Race come out for a double chain match and I marked out big time.

I liked Central States wrestling for the most part but the commentators were horrible. The shows also ran the same three Magnum TA matches that he won in like 15 seconds a piece every week for months with promises that Magnum was "returning to the Central States Area."

They did a lot of importing of stars from other areas - Ted DiBiase came in to wrestle to a DDQ with Bob Brown, Ric Flair paid off Brown to cheat for him when Brown was referee for a Flair-Race Title match. Cousin Junior came in after leaving the WWF (billed as the star of the USA Network) and Flair sold for him big time, they showed a couple of Brody matches from time to time and one Flair-Mongolian Stomper match was aired fairly frequently.

I admittedly haven't seen very much of the Central States promotion. General consensus is that it was one of the worst territories, especially by the 80s. But from what I have seen the announcing was actually one of the few bright spots, IMO. I think Kevin Wall and Rick Stewart were both very underrated. Because just about everything else was as bush league as bush league could get.



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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 07:30 pm
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srossi

 

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DJP wrote: MadFrogVachon wrote: When I first moved to St Louis from Nebraska in 1985 - I turned on Central States Wrestling to see what is was all about. The first episode I watched featured wrestlers I'd never heard of at that point - Bulldog Bob Brown, Marty Jannetty, Mr Pogo, Sheik Abdullah Ali Hassan the Great (the only sheik I'd ever seen with a New Jersey accent) because none of these guys ever got press in the Apter mags. Towards the end of the show they had Harley Race come out for a double chain match and I marked out big time.

I liked Central States wrestling for the most part but the commentators were horrible. The shows also ran the same three Magnum TA matches that he won in like 15 seconds a piece every week for months with promises that Magnum was "returning to the Central States Area."

They did a lot of importing of stars from other areas - Ted DiBiase came in to wrestle to a DDQ with Bob Brown, Ric Flair paid off Brown to cheat for him when Brown was referee for a Flair-Race Title match. Cousin Junior came in after leaving the WWF (billed as the star of the USA Network) and Flair sold for him big time, they showed a couple of Brody matches from time to time and one Flair-Mongolian Stomper match was aired fairly frequently.

I admittedly haven't seen very much of the Central States promotion. General consensus is that it was one of the worst territories, especially by the 80s. But from what I have seen the announcing was actually one of the few bright spots, IMO. I think Kevin Wall and Rick Stewart were both very underrated. Because just about everything else was as bush league as bush league could get.

I remember telling Dusty Wolfe on OSW about how everyone thought Central States sucked, and his reaction was priceless.  He thought all the St. Louis (Muchnick) crew were stuck up and that Central States put on just as good a show.  It was an entertaining discussion as he really got his panties in a bunch.  I guess Central States was one of the few places to give Dusty a push.



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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 07:32 pm
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chrob61



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For me, Continental was a strange territory. I think it morphed off of Southeastern. Then they had Gordon Solie hosting from behind this podium in what I think was a live arena, but for some reason the matches they showed didn't connect much with the promos. I did like Kevin Sullivan and those monsters the New Guinea Headhunters, but besides that not much interest for me on this territory.

I really liked Stampede, and even liked the "Mr. Rogers" sounding Ed Whalen. I liked his folksy delivery and the way he was just bent out of shape when the heels caused mayhem during his in-ring interviews. Also the matches on Stampede seemed competitive, not at all squashy, if that is actually a word....

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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 07:58 pm
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tamalie
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Southeastern was basically two separate promotions for a time.


- Ron Fuller had the Knoxville based part of the promotion starting in 1974.


- In 1977 or 1978, he took over the old Gulf Coast geographic area and combined it soon after with parts of the state that had once belonged to Nick Gulas.


- With two separate promotions that had their own talent, own arena schedules, own angles and feuds, and own TV shows, he could bring someone from one side to the other when he got burned out or use someone from one part as a special attraction in the other when a card needed to be beefed up.


- In 1980 he pulled out of Knoxville after a breakaway group went outlaw and the promotional feud killed the town.


- He was in Alabama, parts of Mississippi, and the Florida panhandle only until around 1984-85 when he went back into Tennessee with Knoxville, Chattanooga, and elsewhere plus some of the surrounding states. This time there was a single promotion with one set of talent, TV, and feuds.


- The Continental name was adopted in mid 1985 to make the TV show easier to syndicate, but it was still the same basic promotion.


- In early 1988 he sold the Alabama end to David Woods who kept the Continental name.


- Fuller kept the Tennessee end and started running TV and cards as USA Wrestling. The talent pool was split about evenly.


- In August of 1988 Fuller sold USA Wrestling to Woods as well and the entire promotion was reunited under the Continental name until it abruptly closed in December of 1989.

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 Posted: Mon Jun 4th, 2018 08:00 pm
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DJP

 

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srossi wrote: DJP wrote: MadFrogVachon wrote: When I first moved to St Louis from Nebraska in 1985 - I turned on Central States Wrestling to see what is was all about. The first episode I watched featured wrestlers I'd never heard of at that point - Bulldog Bob Brown, Marty Jannetty, Mr Pogo, Sheik Abdullah Ali Hassan the Great (the only sheik I'd ever seen with a New Jersey accent) because none of these guys ever got press in the Apter mags. Towards the end of the show they had Harley Race come out for a double chain match and I marked out big time.

I liked Central States wrestling for the most part but the commentators were horrible. The shows also ran the same three Magnum TA matches that he won in like 15 seconds a piece every week for months with promises that Magnum was "returning to the Central States Area."

They did a lot of importing of stars from other areas - Ted DiBiase came in to wrestle to a DDQ with Bob Brown, Ric Flair paid off Brown to cheat for him when Brown was referee for a Flair-Race Title match. Cousin Junior came in after leaving the WWF (billed as the star of the USA Network) and Flair sold for him big time, they showed a couple of Brody matches from time to time and one Flair-Mongolian Stomper match was aired fairly frequently.

I admittedly haven't seen very much of the Central States promotion. General consensus is that it was one of the worst territories, especially by the 80s. But from what I have seen the announcing was actually one of the few bright spots, IMO. I think Kevin Wall and Rick Stewart were both very underrated. Because just about everything else was as bush league as bush league could get.

I remember telling Dusty Wolfe on OSW about how everyone thought Central States sucked, and his reaction was priceless.  He thought all the St. Louis (Muchnick) crew were stuck up and that Central States put on just as good a show.  It was an entertaining discussion as he really got his panties in a bunch.  I guess Central States was one of the few places to give Dusty a push.

Which is kinda funny because Muchnick didn't really have a crew. His "crew" consisted of a pot pourri of top guys from other promotions, including Kansas City.  Pat O'Connor was the booker for St. Louis and he was one of the owners in KC. Then the KC group took it over later and basically ran it into the ground.



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