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 Posted: Thu Apr 4th, 2019 02:44 pm
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srossi

 

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Franchise wrote: The independent contractor thing is dumb in name but I’ve known a few sales reps that were independent contractors in name but certainly seemed like regular full time employees.


Did punk have to pay for the Z packs that he was loaded up on? Why did he keep taking them if he was feeling over medicated? Punk always sounds like sour grapes to me whenever he talks.


How are actors classified? Are they IC’s or regular employees?

With actors it depends, but they're usually independent contractors.  Don't forget, they also have a very strong union so they're not getting jerked around like wrestlers.



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 06:07 am
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Did AEW say they were offering medical? Is it legit medical insurance? Does ROH provide medical coverage?


I’d be curious to see how much medical treatment the E pays for in a year for The talent (I believe someone on here has said before that the E pays for surgeries for talent that gets hurt). Was Punk having to pay for a doctors visit when the E doctor saw him and provided medicine?


It slipped my mind that actors belong to a union.


If the talent doesn’t feel they are getting a fair shake why don’t they unionize or negotiate different things into their contract? Why should it be up to the fans to chant and bring signs to get Vince’s attention?

Last edited on Fri Apr 5th, 2019 06:07 am by Franchise



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 01:31 pm
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Franchise wrote: Did AEW say they were offering medical? Is it legit medical insurance? Does ROH provide medical coverage?


I’d be curious to see how much medical treatment the E pays for in a year for The talent (I believe someone on here has said before that the E pays for surgeries for talent that gets hurt). Was Punk having to pay for a doctors visit when the E doctor saw him and provided medicine?


It slipped my mind that actors belong to a union.


If the talent doesn’t feel they are getting a fair shake why don’t they unionize or negotiate different things into their contract? Why should it be up to the fans to chant and bring signs to get Vince’s attention?AEW is giving medical insurance and I'm guessing it was just added to the Jaguars policy - which must be an incredibly high expense.
Punk did not pay any doctor bills while with WWE.  I don't believe any of the wrestlers pay their own medical bills while working for WWE.  They simply do not get offered COBRA when they leave because they were never employees.
Wrestlers forming a union?  Great idea.  Now try to get the entire WWE locker room to join the union AND have the balls to elect two union representatives to handle all negotiations whether they agree with them or not.  The problem right now is that none of the big guys like John Cena will make a sacrifice for the little guys like Dash Wilder.   It's why it didn't work in the '80s - because Hogan wouldn't be apart of it.  The only way the union will work is if it is started by and pushed by the top guy.  If Roman Reigns unionized the locker room, it might work.  If Zack Ryder tried?  No chance.



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 01:52 pm
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I had a feeling that was going to be the answer on the medical treatment. The talent is taken care of but the E likely doesn’t offer full family coverage. I imagine the talent on the indies either have insurance thru their day job, pay for it thru a provider as an individual or gamble and not have it.


I doubt the union will ever happen for the exact reason you list I just think it’s comical when people want to cry about how horrible things are for entertainers but you don’t see the entertainers making the big bucks offering to make less to help others make more.


Could the E treat the talent better? Probably. Could the talent be smarter with their own money and possibly negotiate differently? Maybe.


I also think it’s funny that they lumped King Kong Bundy into the “they died to early” category. He was in his 60’s and was a giant person I never would have thought he would have an incredibly long life span and how long was he in the E anyways 5-6 years tops if you add both runs together?



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 02:21 pm
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Superstar wrote: Franchise wrote: Did AEW say they were offering medical? Is it legit medical insurance? Does ROH provide medical coverage?


I’d be curious to see how much medical treatment the E pays for in a year for The talent (I believe someone on here has said before that the E pays for surgeries for talent that gets hurt). Was Punk having to pay for a doctors visit when the E doctor saw him and provided medicine?


It slipped my mind that actors belong to a union.


If the talent doesn’t feel they are getting a fair shake why don’t they unionize or negotiate different things into their contract? Why should it be up to the fans to chant and bring signs to get Vince’s attention?AEW is giving medical insurance and I'm guessing it was just added to the Jaguars policy - which must be an incredibly high expense.
Punk did not pay any doctor bills while with WWE.  I don't believe any of the wrestlers pay their own medical bills while working for WWE.  They simply do not get offered COBRA when they leave because they were never employees.
Wrestlers forming a union?  Great idea.  Now try to get the entire WWE locker room to join the union AND have the balls to elect two union representatives to handle all negotiations whether they agree with them or not.  The problem right now is that none of the big guys like John Cena will make a sacrifice for the little guys like Dash Wilder.   It's why it didn't work in the '80s - because Hogan wouldn't be apart of it.  The only way the union will work is if it is started by and pushed by the top guy.  If Roman Reigns unionized the locker room, it might work.  If Zack Ryder tried?  No chance.

Yeah, wrestlers don't have to worry about any medical expenses while under contract, especially these days.  Everything is covered.  It's after they get released that the problems start. 

And these days, I don't think anyone is big enough to unionize the locker room.  That's Vince's strategy in keeping everyone down and making sure no one got bigger than the company.  Cena was the last guy who could do it, and even he probably wasn't big enough. It requires every single guy under contract, including NXT, to be willing to walk out.  That will never happen.  All Vince has to say to a few of the undercard guys is, "Hey, there are top spots available now" and they'll cave in 5 seconds and the machine will keep churning.  WWE is WWE whether Reigns or Ryder is main eventing at this point.     



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 04:55 pm
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If the E pays for everything while the talent is there and sends them off with a clean bill of health (meaning surgeries have all been performed not discussing long term affects of brain trauma) I don’t see why they should be on the hook. Is Punk equally as mad at ROH, IWA-MS and every other Indy he worked for? Because if the E is the bad guy then why isn’t every promotion and if every promotion is evil than why does anyone want to fake fight for them?


Playing hurt was the way life used to be and for Punk to hold it over the E’s head seems like he isn’t accepting The consequences of his own actions. It’s no different than playing tackle football; you knew it was dangerous when you signed up and were willing to risk it all then so why should I feel bad now? Getting paid to do something dangerous doesn’t make the payer evil nor does it make the payee a victim.

Last edited on Fri Apr 5th, 2019 04:57 pm by Franchise



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 05:18 pm
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Franchise wrote: If the E pays for everything while the talent is there and sends them off with a clean bill of health (meaning surgeries have all been performed not discussing long term affects of brain trauma) I don’t see why they should be on the hook. Is Punk equally as mad at ROH, IWA-MS and every other Indy he worked for? Because if the E is the bad guy then why isn’t every promotion and if every promotion is evil than why does anyone want to fake fight for them?


Playing hurt was the way life used to be and for Punk to hold it over the E’s head seems like he isn’t accepting The consequences of his own actions. It’s no different than playing tackle football; you knew it was dangerous when you signed up and were willing to risk it all then so why should I feel bad now? Getting paid to do something dangerous doesn’t make the payer evil nor does it make the payee a victim.

Punk is claiming that WWE did not properly diagnose and treat his concussion and forced him to work through it, much as team trainers used to say everything was fine and put players back on the field in the earliest days of concussion testing in the NFL.  There is no incentive for a doctor paid by the team/company to let someone go home when they're needed to play/perform.  I also seem to recall that Punk had some kind of oozing abscess on his ass that he says was never properly treated and got infected.  He sued the doctor as well as WWE.

Last edited on Fri Apr 5th, 2019 05:19 pm by srossi



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 05:38 pm
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Understood like I said up until recently it was a much different world when dealing with concussions and playing hurt.


I’m not saying anyone should accept a lower quality of life I just get bothered when someone profits from something and then when they are done with it they circle back and say the people who paid them aren’t cool. I’ll be 40 this year and growing up concussions were a joke if you didn’t see Stars after a hit in football you weren’t hitting hard enough. A lot of this stuff was and still is a mystery.



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 05:44 pm
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Franchise wrote: Understood like I said up until recently it was a much different world when dealing with concussions and playing hurt.


I’m not saying anyone should accept a lower quality of life I just get bothered when someone profits from something and then when they are done with it they circle back and say the people who paid them aren’t cool. I’ll be 40 this year and growing up concussions were a joke if you didn’t see Stars after a hit in football you weren’t hitting hard enough. A lot of this stuff was and still is a mystery.

I think there's a big difference though between the '70s and '80s and 2014.  Everyone knew by then.  If Punk's claims are true, it was very malicious. 



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 05:50 pm
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Is punks case still in progress?



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 06:10 pm
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Franchise wrote: Is punks case still in progress?
Dr. Amman sued Punk and Cabana for $4 million for defamation for making these accusations on Cabana's podcast and WWE testified on the doctor's behalf.  Punk and Cabana won that case last year.   I'm not aware of any other outcomes.

Last edited on Fri Apr 5th, 2019 06:13 pm by srossi



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 06:32 pm
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So punk didn’t sue he just said they made him do it and moved on until he had to defend himself?



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 Posted: Fri Apr 5th, 2019 08:18 pm
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Unionizing the WWE would require a strong personality or multiple persons with strong personalities to lead the way and for there to be an outsider with strong experience in labor to handle the nuts and bolts, along the lines of Marvin Miller or Don Fehr. In order to get recognition and legitimate collective bargaining contract talks, the unionizing wrestlers would have to provide some sort of pressure to the WWE that would put the company in no position but to immediately capitulate, such as a strike threat on the eve of Wrestlemania that wrestlers would universally honor. The problem is so many of the wrestlers don't want to jeopardize what they have by agitating for more, even if they think they deserve more, that I don't think a union could ever get to the point of a Mania walkout and even if it did, I don't think enough guys would truly no show to put the card on the brink of not happening, certainly not at this point in time.

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