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 Posted: Sun May 17th, 2020 02:33 pm
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srossi

 

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Blazer wrote: Watts on commentary knew his own angles and what he was trying to get over better than anyone, but in doing so he had the tendency to really talk down to the viewer. Now, this is me in 2020 saying this, not some hillbilly Mid-South fan in 1986 that needed their hand held to understand what was happening. But, yeah, he was kind of a pile of shit on commentary looking back on it.

Trying to remember what angle I watched where it was just so over the top awful...might have been the Magnum/Wrestling II feud where he was trying to explain II's side.

Watts’ angles were actually extremely nuanced for the ‘80s. Look at the typical TV show or movie from the era.  Multiple threads and swerves barely existed. Hillstreet Blues is credited as being the TV show that basically invented that for the mainstream, and if you look at that today it’s simpler than Blue’s Clues now. I think Watts really did need to explain sons of the intricacies of these angles so the fans could get full enjoyment of them, even as simple as the angles seem today. I enjoyed him on commentary. I didn’t like Boesch or Boyd Pierce when they would join him. 



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 Posted: Wed May 20th, 2020 10:39 pm
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The Ultimate Sin
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srossi wrote: The Ultimate Sin wrote: Blazer wrote: Watts on commentary knew his own angles and what he was trying to get over better than anyone, but in doing so he had the tendency to really talk down to the viewer. Now, this is me in 2020 saying this, not some hillbilly Mid-South fan in 1986 that needed their hand held to understand what was happening. But, yeah, he was kind of a pile of shit on commentary looking back on it.

Trying to remember what angle I watched where it was just so over the top awful...might have been the Magnum/Wrestling II feud where he was trying to explain II's side.

That's the angle that's just starting.  II just insulted Poffo in an interview.  

Darsow's just turned heel in the episode I watched today.  And Watts and his anti-Russia comments really take away from the wrestling in my opinion.  I get that he's trying to get us to hate Volkoff, but he just goes on so long about it.  It was the 80s.  We knew we were supposed to hate Russia.  You don't have to convince us.  

The typical wrestling fan in that territory probably busted a nut to that shit. Watts was giving them exactly what they wanted. You can’t critique it in 2020.  

I don't think I'm critiquing it through 2020 eyes.  Maybe, but I don't think that's it.  
Patterson and McMahon comment on Koloff's matches without ranting for 10 consecutive minutes about how Russia turned Latvia into a puppet state while ignoring the in-ring action.  Maybe you're right.  Maybe the Okies lord the shit, but I sure hate it.  
I agree with you on Boesch & Pierce.  Boesch was tough to listen to on commentary especially when he's working alone, and Pierce doesn't add anything at all.  He's not bad or annoying he just doesn't add anything.  Watts or Ross would be better off working alone.



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 Posted: Thu May 21st, 2020 08:13 pm
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wittman2

 

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I always enjoyed it when an announcer would be so passionate about their favorites or anti-heros... Watts and the Russians, David Crockett and the Russians/Horsemen, etc. It made it more than just calling holds or telling me where they went to school.. I always they called it like a fan would, really loving the faces and hating the heels



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 Posted: Fri May 22nd, 2020 04:27 pm
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tamalie
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Here is more from Mid-South.

- Ted DiBiase’s coming heel turn has gotten much more overt without being too obvious. Ted has started wearing a white racquet ball glove on one of his hands. He has explained that his hand is injured and that the bandages become loose due to perspiration during matches. The glove is there to keep the bandages in place. He has medical clearance with Mid-South Wrestling to wear it. This is going to lead to Ted wearing a loaded glove down the line.

- Ted also had an interview in which he sounded really bitter about how he lost the North American Title to Bob Roop, referring to it as a rip off in a tone babyfaces normally don’t use. He demanded a rematch be booked within the next two weeks and he will leave the promotion if he doesn’t get the shot or if he loses the rematch.

- Junkyard Dog got a non-title match with Bob Roop. Akbar’s crew ran in and JYD was going to be the victim of a top rope splash from One Man Gang, but Ted DiBiase ran in to get him out of the way and took the splash instead, sacrificing himself in the words of Bill Watts. This was meant to both align Ted and JYD more closely and to put JYD in line for a title shot to create conflict between them ahead of Ted going heel.

- Ernie Ladd continues to feud with The Assassin who is now forming a regular team with The Grappler. Ladd has used a variety of partners. He recently teamed on TV with Junkyard Dog. The two had a major feud a couple of years earlier, so JYD teaming with him was treated as a big deal. Ladd had gotten involved in saving JYD from Skandor Akbar’s crew in the same match as the DiBiase splash angle. JYD made it clear after the bout that he still didn’t like his former enemy Ladd, but owed him one for the previous save. Now they were even.

- JYD finally got mic time in the body of the show, having previously only spoken during the excised local house show promos, and was really good. The brief Ladd segment aside, his cut a longer interview about the North American Title situation. It was prerecorded rather than done in front of the live crowd and Bill Watts definitely led him through it with key questions and comments, but JYD did a great job and it is understandable that he got over so big.

- Steve Williams has started wrestling professionally. He just completed his NCAA career as an amateur wrestler at Oklahoma, but still had another season of football eligibility remaining due to taking a redshirt season and new NCAA rules stating an athlete can keep eligibility in one sport even if he’s a pro in another. Doctor Death got the superstar treatment from Watts on commentary yet at the same time was still described as a rookie who had a lot to learn. He was green, but showed huge potential, so it’s easy to see why Watts was so excited.

- Iron Mike Sharpe’s push is ebbing. He is a decent worker and has size, but as a white bread babyface is too white bread. He made a much better shouting heel.

- Killer Khan is back after a couple of years away. He had finished up in the WWF at the end of February and I think had gone back to New Japan for a spell before starting here.

- Paul Orndorff is gone. The Samoans have also left the area.

- Bob Roop is still the North American Champion and his mic work as a smarmy heel is outstanding. He’d be soft spoken and polite but blatantly insincere and then would slip into bragging and putting himself over.

- Mr. Olympia remains over as JYD’s partner. He looks great physically by 1982 standards. He’s not Paul Orndorff, but he’s well built and muscular by the standards of the day before steroid use got so rampant in a few years. It is still hard to reconcile that this is Jerry Stubbs.

- Watts has mentioned on commentary that Super Destroyer and Big John Studd were the National Tag Team Champions in Georgia and considered themselves better than any team in Mid-South. This was a set up for them doing a tour in the area to face Mid-South Tag Team Champions Junkyard Dog and Mr. Olympia.

- Black Bart is on hand, still known as Hangman Ricky Harris but otherwise doing the same gimmick.

- Paul Ellering is still around. He’s hurt and not wrestling, so they keep him in the public eye as a babyface by having him do these segments talking about exercise and fitness with him then leading kids from the audience through push ups and sit ups and so on. He’s a terrible babyface. He did this terrible promo talking about how he went to his doctor because he was sick, speaking in a somber tone, then the punchline was his doctor diagnosed him with Pac-Man Fever, which was a hot novelty song at the time. The joke died a cruel death with the fans.

- Jesse Barr and King Cobra are the young up and comers in the undercard, but the level of talent for guys in this role has dipped a bit.

- Dick Murdoch was still doing his crazy ex-marine babyface gimmick. He’s been battling Skandor Akbar’s stable, but his New Japan commitments mean he disappears for weeks at a time and it’s hard to sustain momentum for his feuds.

- Bill Watts is a great commentator. He knows what he wants pushed and knows how to do it. Bill talking about stuff that has nothing to do with wrestling gets under the skin of some people, but I enjoy it. He has a plane and it needed to be repainted. Something went wrong with the paint job and the company that did it thought it only needed to have a particular section redone, but instead found that the entire plane needed to be repainted. They did it at no cost to Watts since the botched paint job was their fault. Watts put them over big time.

Last edited on Fri May 22nd, 2020 04:28 pm by tamalie

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 Posted: Thu May 28th, 2020 11:16 pm
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The Ultimate Sin
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I finished up watching everything I could find from 1983.


I just started watching Central States from 1984.


It's a good show, and well booked, but it lacks star power. They seem to be drawing from areas around the country. Barry Windham won a battle royal. The Youngbloods are teaming and rumors of Steamboat joining have been told. AWA tag champs Blackwell & Patera have been on the cards and National Tag Champs The Road Warriors have taken on Wahoo & Buzz Sawyer. Kerry Von Erich wrestled to stoned that the ref had to help him take his ring jacket off. JYD is also supposed to be coming in. A lot of the show is made up of matches from other areas to showcase the wrestlers coming in.



As far as the lack of star power... Buzz Tyler is the champ. T.G. Stone is wrestling for the belt. Dusty Wolf (no e) is potential rookie of the year. Scott Ferris is a mid carder. Buck Robley is a major face. Ron Ritchie, Ted Oates, and Mike George are terribly bland faces. The Grapplers do add some star power. I've always liked them.


So far I've enjoyed it.



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 Posted: Fri May 29th, 2020 12:44 am
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BuddyPSHayes



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tamalie wrote:
- Bill Watts is a great commentator. He knows what he wants pushed and knows how to do it. Bill talking about stuff that has nothing to do with wrestling gets under the skin of some people, but I enjoy it. He has a plane and it needed to be repainted. Something went wrong with the paint job and the company that did it thought it only needed to have a particular section redone, but instead found that the entire plane needed to be repainted. They did it at no cost to Watts since the botched paint job was their fault. Watts put them over big time.

Watts once spent a entire segment cutting a promo on someone named "Katzaboulas" in Mississippi. To this day, no one knows whether it was a wrestling angle that was abandoned, someone who had IRL heat with Watts, a code name for the Culkins, or what.



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 Posted: Fri May 29th, 2020 01:18 am
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The Ultimate Sin
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BuddyPSHayes wrote: tamalie wrote:
- Bill Watts is a great commentator. He knows what he wants pushed and knows how to do it. Bill talking about stuff that has nothing to do with wrestling gets under the skin of some people, but I enjoy it. He has a plane and it needed to be repainted. Something went wrong with the paint job and the company that did it thought it only needed to have a particular section redone, but instead found that the entire plane needed to be repainted. They did it at no cost to Watts since the botched paint job was their fault. Watts put them over big time.

Watts once spent a entire segment cutting a promo on someone named "Katzaboulas" in Mississippi. To this day, no one knows whether it was a wrestling angle that was abandoned, someone who had IRL heat with Watts, a code name for the Culkins, or what.

He does that a lot.  Not Katzaboulas necessarily, but he'll talk for 10 minutes straight while ignoring the match talking about someone from his personal life that has nothing to do with wrestling.  He's not playing the fame game, like Jesse Ventura, and claiming to know the Rolling Stones or Jennifer Beals.  Watts will go on an on about Rex Garvis's middle son, who detailed his Cadillac and told about a new type of wax that doesn't leave a film in the Oklahoma heat.  He never mentions where Rex works or the type of wax, so it's not a plug. It's like a senior citizen with dementia going on and on about their childhood friends you've never met.  



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 Posted: Fri May 29th, 2020 01:33 am
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The Ultimate Sin
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I forgot to add Central States has a fake Tiger Mask. I think I heard it was one of the Nightmares, Ken Wayne or Danny Davis.

Right after saying Dusty Wolf was a contender for rookie of the year he gets a wicked piledriver from Scott Ferris.

The Match I mentioned where Kerry is stoned was a clip from World Class. He staggers to the ring, makes out with a chick at the ring steps, gets in the ring and staggers order to attack Killer Brooks before the bell, but he kind of loses balances during the attempted kick. About a minute into the match he gets a head scissors on Brooks and decides to take off his ring jacket, but can't do it so Bronco Lubbitch has to help. The rest is uneventful and quick.


Other illustrious Central States stars include Bulldog Bob Brown and Crazy Luke Graham. I'm watching them wrestle as I type this. They both are moving in slow motion. Brown is the face but still wrestles like a heel. Oh... TV time expired before the end.

Tommy Rich is on his way, and Harley Race will defend the Missouri title against Wahoo McDaniels in an Indian Strap match.   Bobby Heenan will be Harley's manager.


I'll keep you posted on what's next!!!

Last edited on Fri May 29th, 2020 01:34 am by The Ultimate Sin



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 Posted: Fri May 29th, 2020 01:49 am
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The Ultimate Sin wrote: I forgot to add Central States has a fake Tiger Mask. I think I heard it was one of the Nightmares, Ken Wayne or Danny Davis.

Right after saying Dusty Wolf was a contender for rookie of the year he gets a wicked piledriver from Scott Ferris.

The Match I mentioned where Kerry is stoned was a clip from World Class. He staggers to the ring, makes out with a chick at the ring steps, gets in the ring and staggers order to attack Killer Brooks before the bell, but he kind of loses balances during the attempted kick. About a minute into the match he gets a head scissors on Brooks and decides to take off his ring jacket, but can't do it so Bronco Lubbitch has to help. The rest is uneventful and quick.


Other illustrious Central States stars include Bulldog Bob Brown and Crazy Luke Graham. I'm watching them wrestle as I type this. They both are moving in slow motion. Brown is the face but still wrestles like a heel. Oh... TV time expired before the end.

Tommy Rich is on his way, and Harley Race will defend the Missouri title against Wahoo McDaniels in an Indian Strap match.   Bobby Heenan will be Harley's manager.


I'll keep you posted on what's next!!!

The Von Erich vs. Brooks match is gawd awful.  Brooks was jobbing by this point?
Right before the end where Kerry jumps over the rope from the outside onto Brooks's knees looked awkward as fuck. I know it's better if it doesn't look completely fluid and rehearsed for hours but VKM might have run out to ringside and fired him if this were WWE. 
I still don't see what anybody saw in Kerry Von Erich.  Srossi of course is in love with his boner but if his name wasn't Kerry Von Erich he'd have come and gone as fast as similar body types, ala Van Hammer, etc.



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 Posted: Fri May 29th, 2020 02:17 am
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The Ultimate Sin wrote: I forgot to add Central States has a fake Tiger Mask. I think I heard it was one of the Nightmares, Ken Wayne or Danny Davis.

Right after saying Dusty Wolf was a contender for rookie of the year he gets a wicked piledriver from Scott Ferris.

The Match I mentioned where Kerry is stoned was a clip from World Class. He staggers to the ring, makes out with a chick at the ring steps, gets in the ring and staggers order to attack Killer Brooks before the bell, but he kind of loses balances during the attempted kick. About a minute into the match he gets a head scissors on Brooks and decides to take off his ring jacket, but can't do it so Bronco Lubbitch has to help. The rest is uneventful and quick.


Other illustrious Central States stars include Bulldog Bob Brown and Crazy Luke Graham. I'm watching them wrestle as I type this. They both are moving in slow motion. Brown is the face but still wrestles like a heel. Oh... TV time expired before the end.

Tommy Rich is on his way, and Harley Race will defend the Missouri title against Wahoo McDaniels in an Indian Strap match.   Bobby Heenan will be Harley's manager.


I'll keep you posted on what's next!!!

I feel bad for you that you had to watch both Bob Brown & Luke Graham in the same match, let alone during the same show. I'd rather listen to Vickie Guerrero screech for 24 hours straight then watch either of those 2 in a match.

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 Posted: Fri May 29th, 2020 04:42 am
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The Ultimate Sin
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freebirdsforever2019 wrote: The Ultimate Sin wrote: I forgot to add Central States has a fake Tiger Mask. I think I heard it was one of the Nightmares, Ken Wayne or Danny Davis.

Right after saying Dusty Wolf was a contender for rookie of the year he gets a wicked piledriver from Scott Ferris.

The Match I mentioned where Kerry is stoned was a clip from World Class. He staggers to the ring, makes out with a chick at the ring steps, gets in the ring and staggers order to attack Killer Brooks before the bell, but he kind of loses balances during the attempted kick. About a minute into the match he gets a head scissors on Brooks and decides to take off his ring jacket, but can't do it so Bronco Lubbitch has to help. The rest is uneventful and quick.


Other illustrious Central States stars include Bulldog Bob Brown and Crazy Luke Graham. I'm watching them wrestle as I type this. They both are moving in slow motion. Brown is the face but still wrestles like a heel. Oh... TV time expired before the end.

Tommy Rich is on his way, and Harley Race will defend the Missouri title against Wahoo McDaniels in an Indian Strap match.   Bobby Heenan will be Harley's manager.


I'll keep you posted on what's next!!!

I feel bad for you that you had to watch both Bob Brown & Luke Graham in the same match, let alone during the same show. I'd rather listen to Vickie Guerrero screech for 24 hours straight then watch either of those 2 in a match.

TV time ran out so it wasn't that bad... until the next episode where they showed the rest of the match.

And odd thing was that Duggan & Reed came over.  They had just feuded in Mid-South, but in Kansas City  Reed is the face and Duggan is the heel.   As I'm typing this I just remembered that KC id Reed's hometown, so it makes more sense.

The show overall is odd because they use so much outside talent and outside TV footage.  The main event of their next card is Jimmy Garvin vs. Chris Adams.  If Adams wins Sunshine get 5 minutes with Precious.  None of these 4 have wrestled on TV in Central States.  Garvin & Adams both did promos from WCCW that aired.



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 Posted: Fri May 29th, 2020 04:06 pm
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tamalie
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The Ultimate Sin wrote: BuddyPSHayes wrote: tamalie wrote:
- Bill Watts is a great commentator. He knows what he wants pushed and knows how to do it. Bill talking about stuff that has nothing to do with wrestling gets under the skin of some people, but I enjoy it. He has a plane and it needed to be repainted. Something went wrong with the paint job and the company that did it thought it only needed to have a particular section redone, but instead found that the entire plane needed to be repainted. They did it at no cost to Watts since the botched paint job was their fault. Watts put them over big time.

Watts once spent a entire segment cutting a promo on someone named "Katzaboulas" in Mississippi. To this day, no one knows whether it was a wrestling angle that was abandoned, someone who had IRL heat with Watts, a code name for the Culkins, or what.

He does that a lot.  Not Katzaboulas necessarily, but he'll talk for 10 minutes straight while ignoring the match talking about someone from his personal life that has nothing to do with wrestling.  He's not playing the fame game, like Jesse Ventura, and claiming to know the Rolling Stones or Jennifer Beals.  Watts will go on an on about Rex Garvis's middle son, who detailed his Cadillac and told about a new type of wax that doesn't leave a film in the Oklahoma heat.  He never mentions where Rex works or the type of wax, so it's not a plug. It's like a senior citizen with dementia going on and on about their childhood friends you've never met.  


C. Katsaboulas, known as Kats, was a real guy and a well known businessman in Jackson, MS for many years. He screwed Bill Watts on a deal somehow. I don't know if he pulled out of something they'd agreed to, didn't come up with money as promised or what. Whatever happened, he made Watts really angry and the Cowboy used the bully pulpit of a regionally televised wrestling show to get the boots in on the guy. Watts had a heel jobber at the time, Carlos Zapata, who apparently looked like Katsaboulas, so it gave Watts an excuse to bring it up every time the guy wrestled.

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 Posted: Fri May 29th, 2020 07:56 pm
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The Watts on commentary talk is cracking me up laughing. I'm making my way through Mid-South 1983 on the network.

Also up to summer 1997 for Nitro.

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 Posted: Sun May 31st, 2020 11:18 pm
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNNW9Ofn31M


Anyone know who Studd's manager is in this clip?



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 Posted: Sun May 31st, 2020 11:45 pm
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The Ultimate Sin wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNNW9Ofn31M


Anyone know who Studd's manager is in this clip?

Larry Sharpe?



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