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amerorig



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[size=Theodore Long][size=Camacho][size=Brodus Clay][size=Evan Bourne][size=Yoshi Tatsu]

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Bye Bye Funkasaurus

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Can hear 'YMCA' in my head while reading those cuts

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Curt Hawkins and Teddy Long - NODQ.com

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Teddy Long was still getting paid? 

Brodus had so much potential on NXT as a monster who started out as Del Rio's bodyguard.  Then they just killed him by turning him into a comedy life that clearly would have a short shelf life.  He could really move for a big guy and deserved better. 

Camacho I never saw anything in at all, and with all the talented indy guys out there I'm not sure how he deserved a Developmental spot and brief call-up.  Once Hunico went under the Sin Cara mask, that ended any need for Camacho.

Evan Bourne really shot himself in the foot.  2 Wellness violations and a car accident.  It's nothing short of charity that they paid him this long.  Senseless waste of talent.

Tatsu deserved better.  The moment he came out with kiddie Japanese techno music you knew he was screwed.  Have no clue why they ever signed him.  We get it, Japanese junior heavyweights who can't speak English will never get TV time in WWE.  That's been made perfectly clear.  So stop signing them.

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Add Aksana to the growing list.

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In the case of Teddy Long, his WWE contract expired. He had been taken off TV for some time and it was well known in the company that he was going to be departing the company.

In the case of Yoshi Tatsu, there was a feeling for some time that he had really regressed in the ring. The company had attempted to find another role for him, including trying him out as a ring announcer in NXT.

Regarding Brodus Clay, the feeling among those I've spoken with is that he fell out of favor with creative, which was obvious when they broke up his team with Tensai and then did nothing with him. His final appearance for the company was putting over NXT champ Adrian Neville on TV, which was a sign there wasn't a plan for him going forward.

We haven't heard much in the way of Evan Bourne's release but he hasn't wrestled in a long time on the main roster after being hurt in a car accident while he was out on a Wellness suspension. There was always a ton of potential for him in the ring but the timing was never in his favor.

The departures of Curt Hawkins and Camacho were the biggest surprises amongst people in the company we've heard from. Camacho was extremely popular within NXT circles and had a strong charisma and was well spoken in recent appearances. Hawkins had several more years on his current deal and had been considered a good hand in the ring, although he had not been utilized beyond putting people over in recent months.

Hawkins has a school he opened in Long Island, so he was already preparing a "Plan B" for himself and will likely get a ton of indy work in the Northeast.

The belief is there may me a few more releases among the wrestlers, but when releases happen, paranoia does kick in and everyone begins to freak out, so we will see.

Last edited on Thu Jun 12th, 2014 07:41 pm by srossi

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two more added - Mindenhal and McIntyre. Both of 3MB.

Last edited on Thu Jun 12th, 2014 07:50 pm by DaNkinator

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DaNkinator wrote: two more added - Mindenhal and McIntyre. Both of 3MB.
Jinder Mahal too.  :)

Shocker that they would release them, only because 3MB has been getting more TV time than they have in months lately, with the undercard program involving the midgets and Los Matadores.  For McIntyre, it's really absurd where his career started and where it wound up.  After 3MB ran its course, which it clearly had, there's no reason with all the TV time they have to fill, that McIntyre couldn't have been repackaged and re-pushed. 

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Had no clue Bourne was still getting paid. Is Heath Slater long for the company at this rate?

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NCJames wrote: Had no clue Bourne was still getting paid. Is Heath Slater long for the company at this rate?
I assume they would've released him when they released the others if they wanted to.  He might be in for a repackaging and a push, so it could be good news.  I'd be concerned if I was Hornswoggle though, speaking of things that have long since run their course.

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Drew McIntyre was going to be great, then his woman got wasted over Summerslam weekend and ruined him.

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I'm surprised to see that JTG isn't among those who were future endeavored. I'm not positive he's still under contract, although he was listed on the WWE roster published in the WON a month or two ago.

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I am sad to see Teddy Long go. There was still a place for him as a neutral/babyface leaning authority figure, but the elimination of the brand split rendered him extraneous.

The Drew McIntyre and Jinder Mahal cuts stun me. 3MB has plenty of shelf life still as an undercard heel act. Why cut them when they played that role well? I think they like Slater in that sort of role even as a single, but Hornswoggle may not be long for the WWE.

Drew McIntyre was once married to a Diva named Tiffany who was GM of ECW in its dying days and later was on Smackdown for a bit. At either Mania or Summerslam, there was an incident at a hotel when a domestic dispute turned into her attacking him. Drew did the smart thing by not laying a hand on her and trying to get away in order to defuse the situation, but the image of him running from a girl seemed to work against him. His push, which may already have been waning, died and he never got pushed hard again.

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Hornswoggle is there for a while at least he has a WWE Movie coming out.

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Add WWE referee Marc Harris to the list of those the company cut today

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Local rumour that Matt Sydal will team up with his brother Mike this weekend on the reboot of Metro Pro Wrestling here in KC.

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tamalie wrote: Drew McIntyre was once married to a Diva named Tiffany who was GM of ECW in its dying days and later was on Smackdown for a bit. At either Mania or Summerslam, there was an incident at a hotel when a domestic dispute turned into her attacking him. Drew did the smart thing by not laying a hand on her and trying to get away in order to defuse the situation, but the image of him running from a girl seemed to work against him. His push, which may already have been waning, died and he never got pushed hard again.
That's TNA's Taryn Terrell, who ironically wound up having a better match with Gail Kim on a PPV (probably the best televised American women's match in at least 5 years) than McIntrye has ever been allowed to have in all his years with WWE.  Terrell must've found a new man because she's on maternity leave right now.

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Zach Ryder gone?

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WWE has updated it's release page and added the name of JTG to the list. He is a gut that hasn't appeared on TV in what seems like forever.

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Heath is probably safe for the time being. Guy's a decent hand in the ring and took the beatings from the oldtimers like a pro.

Drew's the only one that's really a surprise to me (though after putting over Torito he probably shouldn't be). Felt they could break him away from 3MB and repackage him.

Hope CJ Parker hasn't bought a house recently!

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tamalie wrote: Drew McIntyre was once married to a Diva named Tiffany who was GM of ECW in its dying days and later was on Smackdown for a bit. At either Mania or Summerslam, there was an incident at a hotel when a domestic dispute turned into her attacking him. Drew did the smart thing by not laying a hand on her and trying to get away in order to defuse the situation, but the image of him running from a girl seemed to work against him. His push, which may already have been waning, died and he never got pushed hard again.
He also kicked the shit out of Alberto Del Rio last year before Summerslam, which started with him hitting him in the face with a bottle.  That was probably what sealed the deal of him never being considered as "dependable".

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The following released WWE stars commented on their tenures with the company ending today:

Evan Bourne: "Thanks for the love friends! Thanks for the good times @WWE. Sorry to the fans for not getting back on RAW after breaking my foot."

Yoshi Tatsu: "I want to say thank you to @WWE & #WWEUniverse & #YoshiArmy for these 6 years. It's been an amazing experience. In my last days, your huge 'Yoshi Tatsu' chants at @fullsail were awesome! Please keep being cool!I love you guys(^_^) #YoshiArmyForever"

Curt Hawkins: "Oh man I'll be at @JCWprowrestling all weekend... I've waited years to kick the sh** out of @dannydemanto. Another dream come true! Let's go. The schedule is filling up @JCWprowrestling @beyondwrestling @ProWreSyndicate ...Thanks for the kind words guys, I'll see you all soon!"

Jinder Mahal: "Thanks to @WWE for the amazing opportunity. Got a chance to see the world and do many amazing things. Excited to see what the future brings. You can contact me for wrestling bookings, conventions, and other appearances at: Bookjmahal@gmail.com"

JTG: "Damn ! Why I pick up my phone !"

Brodus Clay: "Is it Better 2be held down, held back or let go I'm proud of all the obstacles I fought through wwe and now greatness is on me #MonsteousBC. There is no sadness or bad feelings only opportunity for me to #BreakBreadOrPlayDead so no sad tweets or messages #MonstousBC"

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JTG: "Damn ! Why I pick up my phone !"

Probably the only honest tweet of the bunch.

If I'm Brodus, the first call I make is to Tensai for a list of Japanese contacts.  It might not pay what it once did, but he would get a nice push there.

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There is a lot of talk that the cuts/releases are not done and that there will be cuts on the administrative side of the company as well, perhaps as soon as tomorrow. Potential cuts loom across pretty much all departments.

The word making the rounds is that the current state of The WWE Network, its success or lack thereof, is what is precipitating cuts both in talent as well as potentially in office staff. That wouldn't bode well for state of the Network base when they release the current subscriber numbers at the second quarter earnings conference call.

So it may very well may be that tomorrow continues Black Thursday into Black Friday.
Mike Johnson and I talked about changes that the company could make to the Network to make it appeal to their core base on this week's We Don't Need No Stinkin' Name show for our Elite members, if you are interested in hearing our thoughts on the subject.

Last edited on Fri Jun 13th, 2014 05:40 pm by srossi

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I think there's something to the financial side of the cuts, but the WWE has done clear outs like this almost every year and there are both lots of wrestlers in NXT waiting for main roster spots and with no more brand split, you don't need a deep roster of pushable wrestlers when live bodies to fill out two house show tours is good enough.

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Curt Hawkins ragged on Mark Henry for tweeting about his anniversary with the company yesterday as talents were released saying, "Your colleagues lose their jobs & you tweet that? You're an idiot Mark." Henry responded on Twitter, "First I don't often explain my self to no one!But I had no idea anyone got let go,it's sad.I was asked to post about bday. That's what came out it was about my 18 year journey. I know where you live dude it's a small world. An apology is due. If not well You know me I'll handle our biz."



After being released yesterday Brodus Clay told TMZ that he is going to Japan to protest dolphin hunting in the country. The cause is very important to him. He said he would be open to wrestling there. You can read their story by clicking here.

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Hawkins comes across bitter and reactionary there. Mark isn't a callous guy, so I doubt he said any of that maliciously, if anything...like he said, he was ignorant to what happened with those folks.

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DaNkinator wrote: Hawkins comes across bitter and reactionary there. Mark isn't a callous guy, so I doubt he said any of that maliciously, if anything...like he said, he was ignorant to what happened with those folks.
I can totally see why Hawkins would react that way.  Henry might've made an honest faux pas and there clearly was no intent, but he should be the bigger man and ignore it instead of saying this "I know where you live" bullshit.  Henry's made more than $10 million by barely working, Hawkins hasn't made shit and just lost his job.  Hawkins had a bad day, let it go. 

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I agree. Curt Hawkins just got fired and even if he saw it coming, it had to hurt. He made an emotional response that anyone could make in an emotional circumstance. It doesn't make him a bad guy and I don't think Henry meant harm either.

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We are told there were some creative releases last week along with talent, including writer Jay Gibson. I was told there were other moves the company made in the last seven days to save money that have yet to come out as well. The company is evaluating a lot of ways they can cut fat in advance of the next quarterly earnings release, which is this August. There are a lot of people who work for the company that we have heard from obviously worried about their own short term future, especially if they have been there for some time and make decent money. The belief is that it's going to get rough in the months to come with everything from production to creative to developmental seeing cuts in different areas.

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I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.

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srossi wrote: I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.
I agree. I've enjoyed it since day 1. Still wish they would add more content

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JB5 wrote: srossi wrote: I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.
I agree. I've enjoyed it since day 1. Still wish they would add more content

It seems like months since anything has been added and it's annoying me.  I would like to see if not new things like WWF Championship Wrestling, at least keep continuing with World Class and ECW.  At some point, some NWA and Mid South would be nice too!

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Superstar wrote: JB5 wrote: srossi wrote: I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.
I agree. I've enjoyed it since day 1. Still wish they would add more content

It seems like months since anything has been added and it's annoying me.  I would like to see if not new things like WWF Championship Wrestling, at least keep continuing with World Class and ECW.  At some point, some NWA and Mid South would be nice too!

They might be waiting to hit their numbers before cleaning up new content to add.  But that's a double-edged sword.

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That was my point, he was reactionary and it showed. But he called Henry an idiot, so shots were fired. Both reacted poorly.

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Superstar wrote: JB5 wrote: srossi wrote: I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.
I agree. I've enjoyed it since day 1. Still wish they would add more content

It seems like months since anything has been added and it's annoying me.  I would like to see if not new things like WWF Championship Wrestling, at least keep continuing with World Class and ECW.  At some point, some NWA and Mid South would be nice too!
 

Hasn't it  only been a month or so since they added all 30+ episodes of Clash of The Champions?

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DaNkinator wrote: Superstar wrote: JB5 wrote: srossi wrote: I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.
I agree. I've enjoyed it since day 1. Still wish they would add more content

It seems like months since anything has been added and it's annoying me.  I would like to see if not new things like WWF Championship Wrestling, at least keep continuing with World Class and ECW.  At some point, some NWA and Mid South would be nice too!
 

Hasn't it  only been a month or so since they added all 30+ episodes of Clash of The Champions?

Yeah. They also added about 6 months of ECW that day. Sat Night Main Event will be next if the rumors are true.

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srossi wrote: I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.I'm with you unfortunately word on the street is numbers for subscribers have actually decreased in the last month. Saw it on the interweb, didn't take a whole lot of stock in it until a few folks I talked with in the last few days who are close to the situation. 
Guess the big worry is coming public with the numbers at the next shareholders meeting.

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If they've decreased, that isn't good.

Something drove the stock price up today over 3% but there was no specific news out there.

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very curious what happens when it is available internationally, or at least in the uk. have no idea what that will do for increased overhead, but the uk fans in particular are so ravenous, i imagine subscriptions will get a huge boost.

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hammettime wrote: very curious what happens when it is available internationally, or at least in the uk. have no idea what that will do for increased overhead, but the uk fans in particular are so ravenous, i imagine subscriptions will get a huge boost.
The problem that I've read is that so many outside of the U.S. have used IP masking agents and invalid credit cards, that it's going to take a major boost to get things evened out again.


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If you think about TV shows, it's a rare show indeed that increases its ratings the longer a season goes on. I imagine worldwide coverage will help a little, but there's going to be all sorts of added costs with rights for various countries (the UK and Australia have all sorts of complicated laws in that area, I seem to recall) so I don't think it'll help all that much.

I don't want them to fail, but I do wish they'd do a bit more for the sort of people who are going to be long-term subscribers.

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Many of the hardcore fans have either already seen most or all of the footage that is available on WWE network. We've all had access to a lot of material from mid 80s on via tape trading, DVDs etc. For me, hearing they are releasing all of the Saturday Night's Main events doesn't excite me all that much.

Once they open the vaults a little, then maybe there'll be a spike in subscribers.

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Some people are also under the assumption that WWE gets that whole $9.99 a month, which is just not the case. Systems like Apple & Roku take a huge cut somewhere around 30%. That's before their digital partners get their cut. I would assume that taking that service outside the US will cause higher fees for similar services.

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hammettime wrote: very curious what happens when it is available internationally, or at least in the uk. have no idea what that will do for increased overhead, but the uk fans in particular are so ravenous, i imagine subscriptions will get a huge boost.
I think the UK news will not be good for 2 reasons. Every hardcore wrestling fan I know here already has the network via VPN. When the Network launches in the UK, it won't include the PPVs, due to the WWE deal with Sky TV here. The Network in the UK may even be through Sky, rather than through wwe.com.

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Unfortunately this may end up being an XFL level failure.

Despite what is a great product and value.

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Quattro wrote: Unfortunately this may end up being an XFL level failure.

Despite what is a great product and value.

The only question is can the WWE pay-per-view model of past return as it was?

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Matt Farmer wrote: srossi wrote: I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.I'm with you unfortunately word on the street is numbers for subscribers have actually decreased in the last month. Saw it on the interweb, didn't take a whole lot of stock in it until a few folks I talked with in the last few days who are close to the situation. 
Guess the big worry is coming public with the numbers at the next shareholders meeting.

Due to the six month minimum subscription and it only being about four months into WWE Network, how is it possible for the subscriber numbers to have decreased yet? No one, as far as I know, has even had an opportunity to bail yet.

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Probably refused credit cards that get the network cancelled when it is discovered.

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Quattro wrote: Unfortunately this may end up being an XFL level failure.

Despite what is a great product and value.

This can't possibly end up being an XFL-level failure, because they are actually bringing in money to offset costs.  The reason that the Network isn't realizing any sort of noticeable gains right now is due to the capitalized startup costs that they are taking in right now - it's not amortized over the life in a straight line, it's taken in over the first 12 months if I'm not mistaken being that they are public.   They own all the footage, so there are no programming costs so to speak outside of them taking all live PPV costs into the Network financials.  They should have NEVER announced the subscriber numbers when they did, they should have just announced the realized revenue from subscriptions vs network fixed and variable costs.  Just because they are public doesn't mean they have to announce EVERYTHING - financial numbers are all they are required to put out.

The Oprah Winfrey Network lost hundreds of millions over 2011/2012, Discovery put their people in control of the place, and they turned it around.   WWE has nowhere near the costs that OWN has/had.   And, WWE is making more money per subscriber being that they are their own content distributor.  The downside to that is that they only make money if people want them - OWN gets paid based on subscribers whether they watch or not.  WWE has a cap on how many can possibly buy this, and it's based on their fan base.  My parents wouldn't pay a nickel for this; my kids think it's worth double of what you pay. 

If WWE Network fails, it should not fail for at least 4-5 years, that is if Vince hasn't completely lost his mind.  This is not a short-term model - the moment he announced that it was going out as a $10 per month streaming service he needed to know that it was going to take a minimum of 2 years to get it running to full capacity and if he didn't know that it's his own fault.  There is no going back to the PPV model - after this, nobody in their right mind will buy a PPV at full price.

Short term, WWE should consolidate the Home Video and PPV operations under the Network umbrella.  That will pump up the number slightly.  What kills me is that even though they have almost three quarters of a million subscribers, they STILL got 600,000 Wrestlemania buys.  And nobody cares - they say the network is a failure when it truly hasn't even been given a chance to get off the ground yet.

Famous Mortimer



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Mana: 
Has the number of people calling themselves wrestling fans gone up or down in recent years?

I don't see any way that the network is going to draw people to be subscribers in a couple of years that aren't subscribers now. You mention the weakness in your OWN comparison - that the only people who will give WWE money are specific fans of their product, and that number isn't rising.

I mean, perhaps I'm misunderstanding something, and they can survive and make a healthy profit on the numbers they have now.

Matt Farmer

 

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Mana: 
tamalie wrote: Matt Farmer wrote: srossi wrote: I really hope that the WWE Network catches on and gets to 1 million within the next few months.  It's a great product and it's a shame people are losing their jobs over it.I'm with you unfortunately word on the street is numbers for subscribers have actually decreased in the last month. Saw it on the interweb, didn't take a whole lot of stock in it until a few folks I talked with in the last few days who are close to the situation. 
Guess the big worry is coming public with the numbers at the next shareholders meeting.

Due to the six month minimum subscription and it only being about four months into WWE Network, how is it possible for the subscriber numbers to have decreased yet? No one, as far as I know, has even had an opportunity to bail yet.
Due to people not paying their bills or simply disputing charges after Mania. 
Also they did not get 600,000 PPV buys. Domestically the number of buys was in the 350k range, and there was a huge drop in international buys leading many to speculate that is due to so many people internationally finding ways to subscribe. 
Which also does not bode well for the future of subscribers because investors were assuming a huge increase would happen when they are able to clear international markets. This years Mania ended up grossing something like 10 million dollars less than last years.
As for comparing a possible Network failure to the XFL, if the Network fails that will be a MUCH greater lose than XFL.  They have already damaged their PPV market, they cannot go back and expect people to pay $60 for a PPV. Those days are gone, but they ruined one of their largest revenue streams with hopes of replacing it with another stream of revenue.plus failing at your core business hurts your reputation much more than attempting to a new business.



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